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Post by Darknezz on Feb 24, 2009 19:48:02 GMT -5
Ignoring Kakihara's pathetic excuse of an argument... First off, thank you for actually contributing to the topic. Second, I'd like for you to back up your claims of there being some form of God. All you've done is assert. That's just it darknezz. As i've said before in the first few replies, God is there by belief, will. There is no hard evidence or proof of God. I've said before, we think that god is there because of teachings by Jesus Christ, Son of God. He told us who he is, was, and ever shall be. There is the chance he was a crazy man, but he did perform miracles. Like I've said, I'm not %100 sure if God is real, but I do know that he damn very well may be. The reason I can't fully back up my claims of God being real, is because it's very difficult, because the only way we know he's there is from teachings of Jesus Christ, and those teacings being passed down to this very day. Okay, well, rather than just saying "I know," explain how you got to the conclusion. What logical steps took you there? Critical thinking skills are crucial to a discussion like this. If you can't adequately explain what logical steps you took to get to the conclusion that you reached, you should seriously start thinking about questioning the conclusion. As for the Jesus account that you bring up; There's no contemporary account of Jesus ever existing, or at least, not a Jesus that claimed to be the son of God and performed miracles. The bible was written two hundred years after he supposedly lived, and even then it's been translated so very, very many times. |
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ceby
Junior Member
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Post by ceby on Feb 24, 2009 20:32:05 GMT -5
Well I might as well get on the bandwagon and put in my view here.
God to me is the force/presence that science can not explain, nor might never will. At the very large common science and physics gets all wonky. The way the universe works and is affected by gravity we can only find 20% of that mass in all the stars/ planets. The rest of the mass we call dark matter. We still have no clue how the universe was created. If energy can neither be created or destroyed how did it come to be in the first place? On the sub particle scale we can not tell how it works. Supposedly the Mass Hadron Collider (sp) in Europe will fix this but if we don't find the Higgs Bison. Physicists will be back at square one. That is what I think is god.
As to why someone would worship god? Well I don't, if there is someone/thing so massive and powerful that it created the universe I doubt that it concerns itself with the problems/worship of this tiny blue ball.
Or for all I know it could be Doc Manhattan xp
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Post by Darknezz on Feb 24, 2009 20:52:02 GMT -5
Well I might as well get on the bandwagon and put in my view here. God to me is the force/presence that science can not explain, nor might never will. At the very large common science and physics gets all wonky. The way the universe works and is affected by gravity we can only find 20% of that mass in all the stars/ planets. The rest of the mass we call dark matter. We still have no clue how the universe was created. If energy can neither be created or destroyed how did it come to be in the first place? On the sub particle scale we can not tell how it works. Supposedly the Mass Hadron Collider (sp) in Europe will fix this but if we don't find the Higgs Bison. Physicists will be back at square one. That is what I think is god. As to why someone would worship god? Well I don't, if there is someone/thing so massive and powerful that it created the universe I doubt that it concerns itself with the problems/worship of this tiny blue ball. Or for all I know it could be Doc Manhattan xp If your entire definition of God is "things we don't know" and it doesn't include any dogma or creator, then sure, I believe in it. We will never know all there is to know. Just because we can't explain something doesn't make a transcendental, omnipresent, omniscient and sentient God any more likely or true. You also have some very big misconceptions about science on the whole; We do have an idea as to how the universe came to be. It's called the big bang theory, and I suggest you read up on it, and don't pull out that "Then what caused that?" crap, because as I just explained, that won't make a God any more likely. As for your dark matter explanation... I've got nothing to say. It sounds wrong, but I've never actually read up on it or been taught about it formally, so I don't know for sure, and I'm too lazy right now to figure it out. |
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Post by AznSenzation on Feb 24, 2009 20:57:06 GMT -5
That's just it darknezz. As i've said before in the first few replies, God is there by belief, will. There is no hard evidence or proof of God. I've said before, we think that god is there because of teachings by Jesus Christ, Son of God. He told us who he is, was, and ever shall be. There is the chance he was a crazy man, but he did perform miracles. Like I've said, I'm not %100 sure if God is real, but I do know that he damn very well may be. The reason I can't fully back up my claims of God being real, is because it's very difficult, because the only way we know he's there is from teachings of Jesus Christ, and those teacings being passed down to this very day. Okay, well, rather than just saying "I know," explain how you got to the conclusion. What logical steps took you there? Critical thinking skills are crucial to a discussion like this. If you can't adequately explain what logical steps you took to get to the conclusion that you reached, you should seriously start thinking about questioning the conclusion. As for the Jesus account that you bring up; There's no contemporary account of Jesus ever existing, or at least, not a Jesus that claimed to be the son of God and performed miracles. The bible was written two hundred years after he supposedly lived, and even then it's been translated so very, very many times. Well, than all i can say is, wait till we die, and if i'm right, i'll meet you in heaven, and laugh in your face ^_^. If i'm wrong, well, than you'll know you were right, and you can probably meet me again in some form of life, if you believe in something like reincarnation or something. |
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Post by Darknezz on Feb 24, 2009 20:58:24 GMT -5
Okay, well, rather than just saying "I know," explain how you got to the conclusion. What logical steps took you there? Critical thinking skills are crucial to a discussion like this. If you can't adequately explain what logical steps you took to get to the conclusion that you reached, you should seriously start thinking about questioning the conclusion. As for the Jesus account that you bring up; There's no contemporary account of Jesus ever existing, or at least, not a Jesus that claimed to be the son of God and performed miracles. The bible was written two hundred years after he supposedly lived, and even then it's been translated so very, very many times. Well, than all i can say is, wait till we die, and if i'm right, i'll meet you in heaven, and laugh in your face ^_^. If i'm wrong, well, than you'll know you were right, and you can probably meet me again in some form of life, if you believe in something like reincarnation or something. Thanks for the useless evasions. Your contributions to this topic make me want to make love to you all night long, sweet Suzie. |
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ceby
Junior Member
Posts: 80
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Post by ceby on Feb 24, 2009 21:03:53 GMT -5
I know about the Big Bang theory, and that theory has a major flaw in it. It suggests that all the matter and energy was concentrated at one point and then blew up basically and created the universe. It offers no explanation on how the matter/energy got there in the first place how it was created. Also to lazy to figure out what dark matter is so you bash it? Here is a link. Short and simple just a paragraph explaining what dark matter is. astro.berkeley.edu/~mwhite/darkmatter/dm.html |
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Post by Darknezz on Feb 24, 2009 21:06:16 GMT -5
I know about the Big Bang theory, and that theory has a major flaw in it. It suggests that all the matter and energy was concentrated at one point and then blew up basically and created the universe. It offers no explanation on how the matter/energy got there in the first place how it was created. Again, just because we don't know how the energy and matter got there doesn't make a God any more likely. I wasn't bashing it, I just said it seemed wrong based on what I've heard before. Thanks for the link, though. |
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ceby
Junior Member
Posts: 80
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Post by ceby on Feb 24, 2009 21:58:21 GMT -5
Whoops my mistake then Darknezz I apologize for the hostility. In response to the unknown it really boils down into what type of reality you want to live in.
Dose one want to live in a cold dark universe where everything can be determined by science and when one dies that is it?
Or does one prefer to think of a higher power and some part of life continues to life after death.
Since we can't prove anything yet, I prefer to believe the later. That is just me though call me a hopeless romantic xp. I just sleep better this way.
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kakihara
New Member
You'll have to lip lock with hypodermic needles to lick shots.
Posts: 33
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Post by kakihara on Feb 25, 2009 14:48:28 GMT -5
I know about the Big Bang theory, and that theory has a major flaw in it. It suggests that all the matter and energy was concentrated at one point and then blew up basically and created the universe. It offers no explanation on how the matter/energy got there in the first place how it was created. Again, just because we don't know how the energy and matter got there doesn't make a God any more likely. I thought this was common knowledge amongst atheists. Oh well. Theists often use this tactic to try to disprove atheism, and I see it in every debate about religion. Here's the solution that no one has mentioned yet: The big bang theory incorporates the span of time BEFORE the universe, correct? During this time, chaos was rampant and matter did not behave or abide by the rules of physics and science that we now know today. So it's perfectly reasonable to assume that this, "concentration of matter and energy" could have created itself, or just randomly appeared and became the universe, seeing as how the Law of Conservation of Mass did not exist at that point in time. |
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Post by SnowOwl96 on Feb 25, 2009 14:55:10 GMT -5
Isn't that where scientology comes in or am I just utterly hopeless and don't know what I'm talking about?
Forget that top part.
Religion for me is kinda hard because I'm sooo freaking opened minded it's unbelievable.
Here's how I figure it all. No one can prove that there is a god. There is no logical explanation of how he died and rose from the dead. So some people try to come up with a logical explanation for one by changing the story to make it sound not only good but to make sense out of what they've read or heard.
Yes, I've read the bible, do I remember everything from it, no. Do I live and die by it?, no.
I have no proof that he exists, I'm not one of those crazed religious people that run around and when they see a figure that looks like jesus runs up to them screaming "I BELIEVE!" and kisses the person's feet. I don't like to shove religion down peoples throats. I believe that you have to experience something in person in order to believe in something or someone. Fore me god isn't something you can see or touch, it's something you've got to find within yourself.
As for the big bang theory, I'm positive it happened...would we still be here if it didn't happen?
After all arn't we made from star dust?
The main questions that have popped in my mind and have yet to be answered.
1) If the big bang created everything, then who created the universe? As some have said god and yet others choose to disagree.
2) What's my purpose in life? To live, love, learn and then weither away and die?
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Post by uberryan on Feb 25, 2009 15:25:58 GMT -5
hmm interesting thought it is to think of what the universe was like before it was created... what created the void that universe became? Is there anything outside of the universe?
that'll make your head spin for a few seconds.
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Post by SnowOwl96 on Feb 25, 2009 15:27:11 GMT -5
hmm interesting thought it is to think of what the universe was like before it was created... what created the void that universe became? Is there anything outside of the universe? that'll make your head spin for a few seconds. Lol that actually has made my head spin and I've fallen in deep thought a few times just thinking about it. |
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669
Junior Member
Y HALO THAR
Posts: 156
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Post by 669 on Feb 25, 2009 15:29:01 GMT -5
Yeah I rather believe in a so called "Cold Dark Universe" than in a book filled with a bunch of violence, hate, discrimination and death that contradicts itself and it's supposed to be the word of God who is the almighty cosmic overlord that forces us to obey to him or we will have to die and suffer for an eternity and we have to prove our loyality to him through going to his church every sunday and feel sorry for beeing human, deny the most fun in life and oh, donate money to his cause of course. And of course you don't have any proof of this almighty God either, (surprise thar) no thanks.
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Post by AznSenzation on Feb 25, 2009 15:35:13 GMT -5
Yeah I rather believe in a so called "Cold Dark Universe" than in a book filled with a bunch of violence, hate, discrimination and death that contradicts itself and it's supposed to be the word of God who is the almighty cosmic overlord that forces us to obey to him or we will have to die and suffer for an eternity and we have to prove our loyality to him through going to his church every sunday and feel sorry for beeing human, deny the most fun in life and oh, donate money to his cause of course. No thanks. Where in the hell does it say that we have to worship him as he forces us to or else we die, and have to go to church EVERY Sunday, and donate money, and feel sorry for being human, and deny most fun in life? God accepts anything we do. And he'll forgive us for the greatest of sins. I'm sorry, but that was one hell of a moronic statement to religion. I don't know if you were exaggerating but if you were, that was really stupid. |
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ceby
Junior Member
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Post by ceby on Feb 25, 2009 15:39:52 GMT -5
Yeah I rather believe in a so called "Cold Dark Universe" than in a book filled with a bunch of violence, hate, discrimination and death that contradicts itself and it's supposed to be the word of God who is the almighty cosmic overlord that forces us to obey to him or we will have to die and suffer for an eternity and we have to prove our loyality to him through going to his church every sunday and feel sorry for beeing human, deny the most fun in life and oh, donate money to his cause of course. And of course you don't have any proof of this almighty God either, (surprise thar) no thanks. Where in my post does it suggest that I am talking about the Christian/Jewis/Muslim/any type of god? I am simply stating that there might be a higher power that we can not fully comprehend nor could we ever and that we might be able to go on living some way after dieing. I prefer to think of myself a Deist, I think that something is out there but it doesn't meddle with the life's of anyone or anything. |
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