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Post by shilohdegreat on Feb 24, 2009 0:29:05 GMT -5
It saddens me that I'll be the first to call out Communism.
Communism is evil. "To each according to his need." That means that a guy who works his ass off and enjoys his job gets paid the same exact amount as his partner who does half-ass work and slacks off. That seems like a good thing to you all? You don't think the man who works harder and honestly should be payed more?
No privatization. Nothing is yours. This isn't just bad morally, but also physically. If you worked for your money, and you bought a bicycle, you would make sure that that bicycle was taken care of, and you'd make sure it wasn't being mistreated. If you were provided with this bike, and none of your sweat was put into its provision, you'd care a lot less about the bike. It wouldn't be so important to you if you got it for free.
Speaking of free, the free economy is extremely important. Since the government under Communist rule would control production and such, there'd be no supply and demand. Companies rely on supply and demand to see whether or not they should produce more or less, and they rely on these figures. A company wouldn't be able to tell whether or not it's working at a loss.
Also, since everything is government owned, and this is going to be very relevant, if X Company provides much for Y Communist Nation's wealth, and X is working at a loss and going bankrupt, then Y Country would do its best to pay off X's debts. Doesn't sound to bad? Communism needs to have a perfect system in order to function, once one link shakes, the whole chain will rattle.
Finally, the most important part, invention, innovation, ingenuity. Man's mind is not free under Communism. I can cite many examples from China, North Korea (AKA Nineteen Eighty-Four IRL), and the former Soviet Union. Under Communism, if a man makes an invention, he loses all possession of his creation, and it is used and owned by the government. Remember Tetris? The guy who made it didn't earn a single penny from the game until the U.S.S.R. collapsed. Do I really need to point out how wrong that is? That you could invest blood, sweat, and tears into a life's work only to have the government say, "Thanks! Your invention will do great things for the Fatherland's well being!" Did you ever wonder why so many inventors came to America during the 18th century? U.S. Patent Law makes your invention yours, and you have all the right to distribute and sell what your mind created.
If anyone would care to debate with me, I'll be happy to read your rebuttal.
Read Animal Farm, Nineteen Eighty-Four(although technically a totalitarian oligarchy), and Atlas Shrugged (HOW MANY PAGES?!?!).
P.S. "Look at Soviet Russia before WWII. It wasn't really THAT bad." I hope you're referring to Vladimir Lenin, and not Joseph Stalin. If you meant Stalin, see "Great Purge".
TL;DR
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Post by wista42 on Feb 24, 2009 16:29:07 GMT -5
Communism works perfectly on paper, but does not work at all in practice. Let's say we have 2 people working in a factory. One is very efficient and hard working. The other is lazy and slacks off. Under communism, they will both be paid the same amount, this is the main flaw with it. There is absolutely no reward for working hard, so most people will simply stop trying to do well. Production would fall greatly due to there being no incentive to work hard, and the factory would be shut down. Also, it's not evil at all, just flawed. Well, I would suspect that if a worker was underachieving constantly he would be threatened with death. I know that I would work harder after that. |
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ZombiNe
Full Member
Attack weak point for massive damage.
Posts: 251
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Post by ZombiNe on Feb 24, 2009 16:32:38 GMT -5
Communism isn't evil, just a terrible idea. It's just a stupid system in my opinion.
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Post by Charisma Enigma on Mar 3, 2009 18:49:05 GMT -5
Communism could possibly work well if done right, though I couldn't tell you what that "right" way is. Yet it will probably never be done that way.
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Post by shilohdegreat on Mar 5, 2009 9:34:46 GMT -5
Communism could possibly work well if done right, though I couldn't tell you what that "right" way is. Yet it will probably never be done that way. It has been done the correct way. It's called Capitalism. |
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digitalis
Junior Member
Sending Love to you All XoXoXoXoX
Posts: 54
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Post by digitalis on Mar 27, 2009 0:31:46 GMT -5
Communism is not evil, the principals of the structure of Communism are good, what I find evil is when your liberty is put into question.
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Post by mypallyowndu on Mar 27, 2009 16:11:23 GMT -5
The debate between communism and capitalism is an old one that isn't particularly relevant now. What is relevant, however, is social democracy, particularly with respect the banking regulations and social welfare programs. I read something a few days ago about Europe's reaction to the recession. Basically, they're laying low, waiting to see what the US is going to do because they don't feel the urge to act. That's because Europe has a very active social welfare system that absorbs a lot of the impact of a recession. So, basically, Europeans don't feel it as bad.
Given our rising unemployment rate (8.2%), underemployment rate (14%), and banking system failure, we need to give serious consideration to expanding the social welfare programs first instituted during the Great Depression (social security, FDIC, etc.) and even nationalizing banks.
Also, Atlas Shrugged sucks. It's a second-rate sci-fi novel and a third-rate philosophical tome.
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natalieplz
Full Member
The Crazy Cat Lady
Posts: 233
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Post by natalieplz on Mar 27, 2009 17:02:44 GMT -5
If you get what Communism really is, then it isn't ALL bad. But it still isn't a good idea either, considering the money system is crap. You don't get to own anything, and the government is in charge. To me, Communism, Capitalism, and Imperialism are the worst government systems ever.
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Post by shilohdegreat on Mar 27, 2009 17:29:18 GMT -5
Also, Atlas Shrugged sucks. It's a second-rate sci-fi novel and a third-rate philosophical tome. Don't poison the well. I'll agree Rand is a bit bland of a writer, but the book isn't about the story, it's about the message. I only mentioned it because of her portrayal of how a Social Democratic society could work. Besides, even if you don't like Atlas Shrugged, it sure as hell helped to make a damn fine game in Bioshock. |
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Post by alurebays on Mar 28, 2009 1:14:46 GMT -5
I believe that Communism is evil, but so is capitalism.
with communism, most people (at least in russia's case) own very little, while a select few (government) own everything.
with capitalism, it's basically survival of the fittest, which essentially boils down to the same balance as communism.
With the successful, rich countires, they are never entirely capitalist, or entirely communist. There is a happy medium which is where people are allowed to own property, but the government prevents some from owning too much.
(perhaps 'evil' is a strong word, i'd go with 'stupid')
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psyfi
Junior Member
Psy Zim Fi
Posts: 54
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Post by psyfi on Mar 28, 2009 15:36:36 GMT -5
Communism is a good idea with a good heart but a bad theory to practice.
Once you eliminate competetion and make everybody work the same hours, pay, and so on then people stop caring about the quality.
Take a doctor, he could one of the best in the field and making a very high amount of money, then you take a doctor that is more or less worse and making low money.
If you level off the playing field and give them equal, the worse doctor will be happy but the better doctor will feel that it's pointless.
If he gets the same pay no matter how good he is then why should he continue doing the same good work?
Human nature isn't good hearted at all.
Let's do something clsoer to home for us in the forum, gaming.
If all game companies got paid the same no matter what kind of quality game they put out, they could just pump out ass loads of crap games into the market and not care.
They'll be paid regardless of how good it is and you'll eat it up because that's all you'll ever get.
So Communism is good in theory, but not in practice.
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WeWantFun
Full Member
A rose by any other name would smell as sweet. -William Shakespeare
Posts: 389
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Post by WeWantFun on Mar 29, 2009 1:16:23 GMT -5
in soviet russia, bear rolls you!!! why the fuck do people do that in soviet russia, so and so, watever im tired of hearing that shit |
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Icarus94
Devoted Member
Captain MacMillain
By the way i ain't your daddy.
Posts: 958
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Post by Icarus94 on Mar 29, 2009 18:03:20 GMT -5
in soviet russia, bear rolls you!!! why the fuck do people do that in soviet russia, so and so, watever im tired of hearing that shit in soviet russia, joke tired of hearing YOUR shit. |
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BlitzKey
Devoted Member
Mr. Sonar
*Bang*
Posts: 748
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Post by BlitzKey on Mar 29, 2009 18:15:23 GMT -5
that "In Soviet Russia..." joke is like centuries older than that "Over 9000!" joke. -.-
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yellowfishstick
Junior Member
I'm one bad, motherfucking fish finger
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Post by yellowfishstick on Mar 30, 2009 14:24:33 GMT -5
In theory Communism is not evil, as in theory it will mean everyone is equal, ignoring sex, race, age etc. In real life however communism simply does not work. In all examples of communism, it has been corrupted by a tyrannical leader or simply caused society to collapse on itself.
Public opinion of Communism has always been that it is evil, amongst the upper classes of society. However in the lower ranks of society their is much more support for communism. However this opinion of may simply stem from knife and fork politics (wanting what other people have). Done correctly Communism would be the best course of government for human kind as the idea of it is to create an equal utopia. As shown by Josef Stalins take of communism however it can often be corrupted. Put simply how can communism mean equality when one person rules all?
In most attempts at communism it has ended up being far to similar to its polar oppisite, faschism. Where one man controls all.
In the soviet unions case communsim resulted in famine and large scale death throughout Russia, however this seems more to do with Stalins leadership than Communism as a whole.
The theory behind communism is only seen as evil, by richer or better of people who are afraid of loseing what they have earnt. They argue, that people who do a harder job should be paid more, but by the same logic, people who work as builders or labourers who have physically strenuous jobs, which are in a sense hard jobs should be paid just as much. Their other argument may be that the better paid members of society will have worked harder to get to that position, however it can be argued that if the poorest members of society were offered the same opportunities in education, then they end up with the better jobs. That is what communism offers, equal opportunities.
However thats were the faulst in communism lie. In the perfect communist world where everyone is paid the same, some people will be lazy and refuse to work, and why should those people get the same treatment as everyone else. Obviously not everyone who can't work should be denied help, disabled etc. but the lazy people should not. Stalin got around this problem by arresting people who did'nt work hard enough, and maybye having them shot, creating a terror state.
The alternatives to communism, fascism and democracy. Fascism in my opinion is more "evil" than communism, leaving us with democracy which in the immortal words of Winston Churchill is the worst way to structure a government "but the best we have"
and in the immortal words of Arnold Schwarzineggar: "let of some steam.... Bennet"
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